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ዳግማዊ ዋለልኝ

ዋና አለቃ


Joined: 20 Oct 2010
Posts: 2961

PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ON THE QUESTION OF NATIONALITIES IN ETHIOPIA

The main purpose of this article is to provoke discussions on the sacred, yet very important issue of this country-the Question of Nationalities. The article as it was prepared for a special occasion (where detailed analysis was due time and other inconveniences impossible) suffers from generalizations and inadequate analysis. But I still feel it is not mediocre for a beginning. I expect my readers to avoid the temptation of snatching phrases out of their context and capitalizing on them. Instead every point raised here should be examined in the light of the whole analysis.

We have reached a new stage in the development of the student movement, a level where Socialism as a student ideology has been taken for granted, and reaction with all its window dressing is on the defensive. The contradictory forces are no more revolution versus reform, but correct scientific Socialism versus perversion and fadism.

The Socialist forces in the student movement till now have found it very risky and inconvenient to bring into the open certain fundamental questions because of their fear of being misunderstood. One of the delicate issues which has not yet been resolved up to now is the Question of Nationalities-some people call it ridiculously tribalism-but I prefer to call it nationalism. Panel discussions, articles in STRUGGLE and occasional speakers, clandestine leaflets and even tete-a-tete groups have not really delved into it seriously. Of course there was indeed the fear that it may alienate certain segments of the student population and as well the fear that the government may take advantage of an honest discussion to discredit the revolutionary student movement.

Starting from last year, a small minority began to discuss this delicate issue for the most part in secluded places. Discussions, even private, leak out and because they were not brought into the open they normally led to backbiting, misunderstanding and grossly exaggerated rumours. I think students are mature enough to face reality even if they are very sensitive. And the only solution to this degeneration, as witnessed from some perverted leaflets running amock [amok] these two weeks, is open discussion.

What are the Ethiopian peoples composed of? I stress on the word peoples because sociologically speaking at this stage Ethiopia is not really one nation. It is made up of a dozen nationalities with their own languages, ways of dressing, history, social organization and territorial entity. And what else is a nation? It is not made of a people with a particular tongue, particular ways of dressing, particular history, particular social and economic organization? Then may I conclude that in Ethiopia there is the Oromo Nation, the Tigrai Nation, the Amhara Nation, the Gurage Nation, the Sidama Nation, the Wellamo [Wolayta] Nation, the Adere [Harari] Nation, and however much you may not like it the Somali Nation.

This is the true picture of Ethiopia. There is of course the fake Ethiopian Nationalism advanced by the ruling class and unwillingly accepted and even propagated by innocent fellow travellers.

What is this fake Nationalism? Is it not simply Amhara and to a certain extent Amhara-Tigre supremacy? Ask anybody what Ethiopian culture is? Ask anybody what Ethiopian language is? Ask anybody what Ethiopian music is? Ask anybody what the national dress is? It is either Amhara or Amhara-Tigre!!

To be a genuine Ethiopian one has to speak Amharic, to listen to Amharic music, to accept the Amhara-Tigre religion, Orthodox Christianity and to wear the Amhara-Tigre Shamma in international conferences. In some cases to be an Ethiopian, you will even have to change your name. In short to be an Ethiopian, you will have to wear an Amhara mask (to use Fanons expression). Start asserting your national identity and you are automatically a tribalist, that is if you are not blessed to be born an Amhara. According to the constitution you will need Amharic to go to school, to get a job, to read books (however few) and even to listen to the news on Radio Ethiopia unless you are a Somali or an Eritrean in Asmara for obvious reasons.

To anybody who has got a nodding acquaintenance with Marxism, culture is nothing more than the super-structure of an economic basis. So cultural domination always presupposes economic subjugation. A clear example of economic subjugation would be the Amhara and to a certain extent Tigrai Neftegna system in the South and the Amhara-Tigre Coalition in the urban areas. The usual pseudo-refutation of this analysis is the reference to the large Amhara andd Tigrai masses wallowing in poverty in the countryside. For that matter during the heydays of British imperialism a large mass of British Workers had to live under inhuman conditions.

Another popular counter argument is that there are two or three ministers of non-amhara-Tigre Nationality in the Cabinet, one or two generals in the army, one or two governors and a dozen balabats in the countryside. But out and out imperialists like the British used to rule their colonies mainly by enlisting the support of tribal chiefs, who were much more rich than the average citizen of the British Metropolis. The fact that (Houphet) Boigne and Senghor were members of the French National Assembly and the fact that they were even ministers did not reduce an iota of Senegalese and Ivory Coast [Ivoirians] loss of political independence.

Of course the economic and cultural subjugation by the Amharas and their junior partners the Tigres is a historical accident. Amharas are not dominant because of inherent imperialist tendencies. The Oromos could have done it, the Wellamos [Wolaytas] could have done it and history proves they tried to do so. But that is not an excuse for the perpetuation of this situation. The immediate question is we must declare a stop to it. And we must build a genuine national- state.

And what is this genuine national-state? It is a state in which all nationalities participate equally in state affairs, it is a state where every nationality is given equal opportunity to preserve and develop its language, its music and its history. It is a state where Amharas, Tigres, Oromos, Aderes [Harari], Somalis, Wollamos [Wolaytas], Gurages, etc. are treated equally. It is a state where no nation dominates another nation be it economically or culturally.

And how do we achieve this genuine democratic and egalitarian state?

Can we do it through military? No!! A military coup is nothing more but a change of personalities. It may be a bit more liberal than the existing regime but it can never resolve the contradiction between either classes or nationalities. The Neway brothers and Tadesse Birus could not have done it. Talking about Mengistu and Tadesse, one cannot fail to remember the reaction that the Mengistus coup though a family one and at that by a sector of Shoa Amharas (with few exceptions, of course among the Workeneh) was very popular just because it was staged by Ethiopians-Amharas. With Tadesse, it was automatically a tribalist uprising. Why? Tadesse an Oromo cannot stage a nationalist coup but Oromo Supermacist [supremacy].

I am not equivocal in condemning coups, but the Tadesse coup had at least one significant quality and a very important one too. It gave our Oromo Brothers and Sisters self-respect. And self-respect is an important pre-requisite for any mass-based revolution. Even the so-called revolutionaries who scoffed at the coup just like the mass of the student body, could not comprehend this quality. You can clearly see in this instance the power of the Amhara-Tigre supremacist [supremacist] feelings. They clearly proved that they were nothing more than the products of government propaganda on this question.

Can the Eritrean Liberation Front and the Bale armed struggle achieve our goal? Not with their present aims and set-up.

Both these movements are exclusive in character, led by the local Bourgeoisie in the first instance and the local feudal lords in the second. They do not have international outlook, which is essential for our goal. They are perfectly right in declaring that there is national oppression. We do not quarrel with them on this score. But their intention is to stop there. They do not try to expand their struggles to the other nationalities. They do not attempt to make a broad-based assault on the foundations of the existing regime. They deliberately try to forget the connection of their local ruling classes with the national oppression. In short these movements are not led by peasants and workers. Therefore, they are not Socialists, it would only be a change of masters for the masses. But for the Socialists the welfare of the masses comes first.

The same can be said for the Gojjam uprising. But I would like to take this opportunity once again to show how much Amhara supremacism [supremacism] is taken for granted in this Campus.

To applaud the ELF is a sin. If anything favourable is written out, it is automatically refuted by both USUAA and NUEUS. But the Gojjam affair was different. Support for it was practically a show of identity to the so-called revolutionaries.

Mind you, I am just saying that these movements are not lasting solutions for our goal-the set-up of a genuine Nationalist Socialist State. I am all for them, the ELF, the Bale movements, the Gojjam uprising, to the extent that they have challenged and weakened the existing regime, and have created areas of discontent to be harnessed later on by a genuine Socialist revolution.

One thing again is certain. I do not oppose these movements just because they are secessionists. There is nothing wrong with secessionism as such. For that matter secession is much better than nationally oppressive government. I quote Lenin, “… People resort to secession only when national oppression and national antagonisms make joint life absolutely intolerable and hinder any and all economic intercourse. In that case the interests of the freedom of the class struggle will be best served by Secession. I would also like to quote the resolution on the question of nationalities from the London International Socialist Congress of 1896 attended, supported and adopted by the Bolsheviks who brought about the October revolution, This Congress declares that it stands for the full right of all nations to self-determination and expresses its sympathy for the workers and peasants of every country now suffering under the yoke of military, national or other absolutism.

As long as secession is led by the peasants and workers and believes in its internationalist obligation, it is not only to be supported but also militarily assisted. It is pure backwardness and selfishness to ask a people to be partners in being exploited till you can catch up. We should never dwell on the subject of secession, but whether it is progressive or reactionary. A Socialist Eritrea and Bale would give a great impetus to the revolution in the country and could form an egalitarian and democratic basis for re-unification.

To come back to our central question: How can we form a genuine egalitarian national-state? It is clear that we can achieve this goal only through violence, through revolutionary armed struggle. But we must always guard ourselves against the pseudo-nationalist propaganda of the regime. The revolution can start anywhere. It can even be secessionist to begin with, as long as led by the progressive forces-the peasants and the workers, and has the final aim the liberation of the Ethiopian Mass with due consideration to the economic and cultural independence of all the nationalities. It is the duty of every revolutionary to question whether a movement is Socialist or reactionary not whether a movement is secessionist or not. In the long run Socialism is internationalism and a Socialist movement will never remain secessionist for good.

To quote Lenin again, From their daily experience the masses know perfectly well the value of geographical and economic ties and the advantages of a big market and a big state. From this point of view of the struggle as well, a regime like ours harassed from corners is bound to collapse in a relatively short period of time. But when the degree of consciousness of the various nationalities is at different levels, it is not only the right but the duty of the most conscious nationality to first liberate itself and then assist others in the struggle for total liberation. Is that not true of Korea? We do support this movement, dont we? Then, what is this talk of tribalism, secessionism, etc..?


ቀውሱ ወዳጄ .....የታላቁ ዋለልኝ መኮንን ፅሁፍ መልእክቱ ምንአልባት ይዘልቅህ ከሆነ ደጋግመህ አንብብና ሞክረው
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“Meles Zenawi's passion was in abolishing poverty" Former Prime Minister of United Kingdom Gordon Brown
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ቆቁ

ዋና አለቃ


Joined: 21 Sep 2003
Posts: 4564
Location: united states

PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

ባለፈው ያስረዳሁህን ሀሳብ እንደአዲስ ስትመለስበት ጊዜ ከዚህ በፊት እንዳልኩት የመርሳት በሽታ ይዞሀል ወይም በትክክል ቀውሰሀል ....ስለዚህ ለአንተ እንደአዲስ መፃፍም አያስፈልገኝም ......ባለፈው የመለስኩልህን ልድገመው


ፈዳላው ዳግማዊ ዝም ብለህ ትንከራተታለህ ::
ጨዋታው እና መልሱ ቀላል ነበር እኮ ፈዳላው ወዳጄ

Quote:

ዋለልኝ ሊናገር የፈለገው ኢትዮጵያ አንድ ወጥ ሳትሆን የብዙ ብሔሮች ስብስብ መሆኗን ነው .......ማንም ሰው የሴት ልጅ ተፈጥሮ ከወንድ ልጅ ተፈጥሮ እንደሚለይ የማያቅ የለም አይደል እንዴ Question Wink ታዲያ ለምን ይመስሎታል ስለሴት ልጅ መብት እና እኩልነት ብዙ ታላላቅ ሰዎች በየዘመናቱ ትግል የሚያካሂዱት

ይህንን እኮ ነው ያልኩት የኢትዮጵያን የብሄሮች ስብስብ መሁኑዋን የማያውቅ ገበሬ እና እረኛ አልነበረም የለምም የግድ አራተኛ ዓመት የፖለቲካ ሳይንስ ማጥናት አያስፈልግም እኮ ነው የምልህ

የኢትዮጵያ ሕዝብ በፊውዳል አገዛዝ ተሰቃይቶ ነበር ::
ይህንን ስቃዩን ለማስታገስ እነ ዋለልኝ ያደረጉት ጥረት ስቃዩን ማስታገስ አልቻለም :: እንደውም የባሰ እልቂት እና ንትርክ ውስጥ ነው የከተተው እኮ ነው የምልህ

ዋለልኝ ይህንን ከታች የገለበጥከውን ጽሁፍ ከጻፈ ጀምሮ የኢትዮጵያ ተማሪዎች ቂጥና ጀርባ ሆነው እንዳልነበሩ ለመሆን በቅተዋል :: ደም በደም ተፋሰዋል ተራርደዋል ተሰደዋል ተደናቁረዋል :: አሁንም እየተደናቆሩ ናቸው
መግባባት የሚባል ነገር የለም

[size=30]ይህ የዋለልኝ ጄኔሬሽን እስካልጠፋ ድረስ የኢትዮጵያ ሕዝብ በሰላም ይኖራል ማለት ያጠራጥራል !![/size]

ያኔ ከዋለልኝ ሞት በሁዋላ "" ያንኪ ሆም " ሲል የነበረ ሁላ የሚገኘው አሜሪካ ወይም ኢትዮጵያ ቁጭ ብሎ የአሜሪካ ቀኝ እጅ ነው የሆነው

የሴቶችም ትግል ሆነ የብሄሮች ጥያቄ የሐገሩን ሰርዶ በሐገሩ በሬ እንደሚባለው ሁላ በራሳችን ባህልና በራሳችን አስተሳሰብ ብንታገል ውጤቱ ሌላ የተቃና ይሆን ነበር ነው የምልህ

ዋለልኝ ባመጣው የሶሻሊዝም አስተሳሰብ መላው ልሂቅ ሁላ በዚህ የዞረ ድምር አይዲኦሎጂ ተሳክሮ እና መርቅኖ እርስ በእርስ ለመተራረድ በቃ :: አልበቃ ብሎ አሁንም እርስ በርስ መነታረክ : አለመደማመጥ ከዛም አልፎ ንዩሮሎጂካል ዲሶርደር በኢትዮጵያ ልሂቆች መካከል እንዲሰራጭ ምክንያት ነው ይሆነው

[size=30] የሰቶች ጥያቄ እና የብሄረ ሰቦች ጥያቄ በራሱ በኢትዮጵያ ሕዝብ ትግል እና በኢትዮጵያ ሕዝብ አስተሳሰብ መፈታት ይቻል ነበር መፍትሄው ሶሻሊዝም ወይም የኮምሶሞል ውይይት አልነበረም ይህንን እድል ነው ዋለልኝ መኮንን ቆሻሻ የደፋበት [/size]


Quote:
ኢትዮጵያ የብዙ ብሔሮች ስብስብ መሆኗን ....ሴቶች ከወንዶች ጋር አብረው አለም ላይ እንዳሉ ወዘተ ..... ብቻ ማወቁ ምን ፋይዳ አለው Question


ምንድነው ዋለልኝ ያደረገው የሸመደደውን ከመትፋት በስተቀር

የሴቶች እኩልነት ጥያቄ እስከ አሁን ድረስ በዋለልኝ የሶሻሊዝም መመሪያ መሰረት በኢትዮጵያችን መፍትሄ አላገኘም ::
እንደውም የሴቶች እህቶቻችን ግርዘት በሶሻሊዝም ሳይሆን በባህላዊ ስብሰባ : በእድርና በአፍርስታ : በገዳ በሐይማኖት ሰዎች አማካይነት ነው ሊወገድ የበቃው ::

[size=30]የት ነው ዋለልኝ እዚህ ? [/size]

Quote:

የኢትዮጵያ ብሔሮች በአመት አንድ ጊዜ ከነባህል ልብሳቸው መስቀል አደባባይ እየወጡ እንዲጨፍሩና እንደላንቲካ እንዲታዩ ወይም ለቱሪስት መስህብነት


ፈዳላው የምን መዘላበድ ነው
ዋለልኝ የዘላበደው በቴሌቪዥን እና ( ያን ጊዜ ቴለቪሽን ብርቅዬ ነገር ነበር ) በቤተ መንግስቱ ግብር ላይ በተመለከተው ብቻ ነበር ::

ቤተ መንግስት ውስጥ ዋለልኝ እንዳስቀመጠው ነበር

ነገር ግን በእሬቻ በዓል ላይ በመስቀል በዓል ላይ በጥምቀት በዓል ላይ ግን የአዲስ አበባ ነዋሪ እንደ ባህሉ በመልበስ እንደ ባህሉ በመዝፈን ነበር በዓሉን የሚያሳልፈው

ስማ የምን ቱሪስት ነው የምትለው
በመስቀል በዓል እና በእሬቻ በዓል በጥምቀት በዓል ለቱሪስት ሲባል የሚል አተላ የሆነ ጽሁፍህን ብታነሳው መልካም ነው ::

ምን ታደርግ በኒዎሮሎጂካል ዲስ ኦርደር ውስጥ የምትገኝ ግለሰብ ስለሆንክ ነው ይህንን የጻፍከው

[size=30] ስማ ፈዳላው የግንቦት ልደታ የኦርቶዶክስ ክርስቲያኖች በዓል ነው ነገር ግን የአዶከብሬ በዓልም አብሮ በዚህ እለት ይከበራል ይህንን በዓል የሚያከብረው የኦሮሞና የአማራ ሕብረተ ሰብ በአንድ ላይ ነው [/size]

[size=30] የታህሳስ ገብሬል የክርስቲያኖች በዓል ነው የሚከበረው ግን በጠጅ ሳርና በአሪቲ ነው [/size]

ይህንን መገንዘብ ያቃተው ዋለልኝ መኮንን በኒዎሮሎጂካል ዲሶርደር ታውኮ ቦልሼ Vክን መመሪያ ኢትዮጵያ ውስጥ ረጭቶ ጭምልቅልቅ አደረገን

[size=30] ይህንን ጉዳይ አሌክሳንደር ቡላቶቪጭ መስማት ቢችል ኖሮ ዋለልኝን እንደገና ኢትዮጵያዊነት ያስተምረው ነበር [/size]


Quote:
ታላቁ ዋለልኝ ያለው መብታቸው ይከበርላቸው ነው ......መኖራቸውን ማወቅማ ቱሪስትም ሊያውቀው ይችላል ...ግን እንደኢትዮጵያዊነታቸው የማንም የበላይም የበታችም አይደሉም .....ስለዚህ በራሳቸው ቋንቋ የመጠቀም ....ባህላቸውን የመጠበቅ .....ታሪካቸውን የመንከባከብና የፈለጉትን ሀይማኖት የመከተል መብታቸውን በተመለከተ ንጉስ እከሌም ሆነ ጭቃሹም እንቶኔ ምንም አይመለከታቸውም ነው


እንዴት ?

እንዴት የሚለው ጥያቄ ላይ እኮ ነው ዋለልኝ መኮንን መርዙን የረጨው
በኢትዮጵያ ውስጥ በፊውዳሉ ዘመን ችግር የከፋ ችግር እንዳለ ግልጽ ነበር ::

የብሄረ ሰቦች ጥያቄ ሳይሆን ራሱ የወሎ ድርቅ እየተባባሰ የመጣበት ወቅት ነበር :: የኢትዮጵያ ሕዝብ በቀዳማዊ ሐይለስላሴ ዘመነ መንግስት በክፉ ችግር የወደቀበት ዘመን ነበር ::


ይህንን ችግሩን ለመቅረፍ የኢትዮጵያ ተማሪዎች የዋለልኝ ዝባዝንኬ ወደዛ ወርውረው የቻሉትን ለመርዳት ሞክረው ነበር ::

ደርግ (ሌላው የዋለልኝ ጄኔሬሽን ) ተማሪዎችን በእጁ ለማድረግ ሶሻሊዝም ነው መመሪያ ሲል ""
"" ዋለልኝ ለምን ለምን ሞተ
" ማርታ ለምን ለምን ሞተች " የሚለው በኑሮሎጂካል ዲሶርደር የተበከሉ ተማሪዎች የገጠሙት ግጥም እና ሆታ ተጀመረ ብዙ አልቆየም በጥይት እሩምታ ሁሉም ለስደት እና ለሞት ተዳረገ

ባህል የመንከባከቡ ጉዳይ ባህልን የመጠበቁ ጉዳይ የኢትዮጵያ ሕዝቦች ጉዳይ ነበር ይህ ጉዳይ ዋለልኝ መኮንን ከቦልሼቪክ ፓርቲ እንደቃረመው አልነበረም ::

በራሳችን አስተሳሰብ እንዳንሄድ
የራሳችንን መላ እና ዘዴ እንዳንፈጥር
የዓለምን ሁኔታ በርቀት እያየን ራሳችንን እንዳናስተካክል
በዚህ በዋለልኝ ጄኔሬሽን ለመታወር በቅተናል ::
ፈላስፋው ቆቁ የሚቀጥል
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እናሽንፋለን

አዲስ


Joined: 13 Jul 2010
Posts: 36

PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ባይገባቸውም ስለ ዋለልኝ ታላቅነት ተስፋ ሳትቆርጥ ማስተማርህን ቀጥልበት ::
ዳግማዊ ዋለልኝ እንደጻፈ(ች)ው:
ON THE QUESTION OF NATIONALITIES IN ETHIOPIA

The main purpose of this article is to provoke discussions on the sacred, yet very important issue of this country-the Question of Nationalities. The article as it was prepared for a special occasion (where detailed analysis was due time and other inconveniences impossible) suffers from generalizations and inadequate analysis. But I still feel it is not mediocre for a beginning. I expect my readers to avoid the temptation of snatching phrases out of their context and capitalizing on them. Instead every point raised here should be examined in the light of the whole analysis.

We have reached a new stage in the development of the student movement, a level where Socialism as a student ideology has been taken for granted, and reaction with all its window dressing is on the defensive. The contradictory forces are no more revolution versus reform, but correct scientific Socialism versus perversion and fadism.

The Socialist forces in the student movement till now have found it very risky and inconvenient to bring into the open certain fundamental questions because of their fear of being misunderstood. One of the delicate issues which has not yet been resolved up to now is the Question of Nationalities-some people call it ridiculously tribalism-but I prefer to call it nationalism. Panel discussions, articles in STRUGGLE and occasional speakers, clandestine leaflets and even tete-a-tete groups have not really delved into it seriously. Of course there was indeed the fear that it may alienate certain segments of the student population and as well the fear that the government may take advantage of an honest discussion to discredit the revolutionary student movement.

Starting from last year, a small minority began to discuss this delicate issue for the most part in secluded places. Discussions, even private, leak out and because they were not brought into the open they normally led to backbiting, misunderstanding and grossly exaggerated rumours. I think students are mature enough to face reality even if they are very sensitive. And the only solution to this degeneration, as witnessed from some perverted leaflets running amock [amok] these two weeks, is open discussion.

What are the Ethiopian peoples composed of? I stress on the word peoples because sociologically speaking at this stage Ethiopia is not really one nation. It is made up of a dozen nationalities with their own languages, ways of dressing, history, social organization and territorial entity. And what else is a nation? It is not made of a people with a particular tongue, particular ways of dressing, particular history, particular social and economic organization? Then may I conclude that in Ethiopia there is the Oromo Nation, the Tigrai Nation, the Amhara Nation, the Gurage Nation, the Sidama Nation, the Wellamo [Wolayta] Nation, the Adere [Harari] Nation, and however much you may not like it the Somali Nation.

This is the true picture of Ethiopia. There is of course the fake Ethiopian Nationalism advanced by the ruling class and unwillingly accepted and even propagated by innocent fellow travellers.

What is this fake Nationalism? Is it not simply Amhara and to a certain extent Amhara-Tigre supremacy? Ask anybody what Ethiopian culture is? Ask anybody what Ethiopian language is? Ask anybody what Ethiopian music is? Ask anybody what the national dress is? It is either Amhara or Amhara-Tigre!!

To be a genuine Ethiopian one has to speak Amharic, to listen to Amharic music, to accept the Amhara-Tigre religion, Orthodox Christianity and to wear the Amhara-Tigre Shamma in international conferences. In some cases to be an Ethiopian, you will even have to change your name. In short to be an Ethiopian, you will have to wear an Amhara mask (to use Fanons expression). Start asserting your national identity and you are automatically a tribalist, that is if you are not blessed to be born an Amhara. According to the constitution you will need Amharic to go to school, to get a job, to read books (however few) and even to listen to the news on Radio Ethiopia unless you are a Somali or an Eritrean in Asmara for obvious reasons.

To anybody who has got a nodding acquaintenance with Marxism, culture is nothing more than the super-structure of an economic basis. So cultural domination always presupposes economic subjugation. A clear example of economic subjugation would be the Amhara and to a certain extent Tigrai Neftegna system in the South and the Amhara-Tigre Coalition in the urban areas. The usual pseudo-refutation of this analysis is the reference to the large Amhara andd Tigrai masses wallowing in poverty in the countryside. For that matter during the heydays of British imperialism a large mass of British Workers had to live under inhuman conditions.

Another popular counter argument is that there are two or three ministers of non-amhara-Tigre Nationality in the Cabinet, one or two generals in the army, one or two governors and a dozen balabats in the countryside. But out and out imperialists like the British used to rule their colonies mainly by enlisting the support of tribal chiefs, who were much more rich than the average citizen of the British Metropolis. The fact that (Houphet) Boigne and Senghor were members of the French National Assembly and the fact that they were even ministers did not reduce an iota of Senegalese and Ivory Coast [Ivoirians] loss of political independence.

Of course the economic and cultural subjugation by the Amharas and their junior partners the Tigres is a historical accident. Amharas are not dominant because of inherent imperialist tendencies. The Oromos could have done it, the Wellamos [Wolaytas] could have done it and history proves they tried to do so. But that is not an excuse for the perpetuation of this situation. The immediate question is we must declare a stop to it. And we must build a genuine national- state.

And what is this genuine national-state? It is a state in which all nationalities participate equally in state affairs, it is a state where every nationality is given equal opportunity to preserve and develop its language, its music and its history. It is a state where Amharas, Tigres, Oromos, Aderes [Harari], Somalis, Wollamos [Wolaytas], Gurages, etc. are treated equally. It is a state where no nation dominates another nation be it economically or culturally.

And how do we achieve this genuine democratic and egalitarian state?

Can we do it through military? No!! A military coup is nothing more but a change of personalities. It may be a bit more liberal than the existing regime but it can never resolve the contradiction between either classes or nationalities. The Neway brothers and Tadesse Birus could not have done it. Talking about Mengistu and Tadesse, one cannot fail to remember the reaction that the Mengistus coup though a family one and at that by a sector of Shoa Amharas (with few exceptions, of course among the Workeneh) was very popular just because it was staged by Ethiopians-Amharas. With Tadesse, it was automatically a tribalist uprising. Why? Tadesse an Oromo cannot stage a nationalist coup but Oromo Supermacist [supremacy].

I am not equivocal in condemning coups, but the Tadesse coup had at least one significant quality and a very important one too. It gave our Oromo Brothers and Sisters self-respect. And self-respect is an important pre-requisite for any mass-based revolution. Even the so-called revolutionaries who scoffed at the coup just like the mass of the student body, could not comprehend this quality. You can clearly see in this instance the power of the Amhara-Tigre supremacist [supremacist] feelings. They clearly proved that they were nothing more than the products of government propaganda on this question.

Can the Eritrean Liberation Front and the Bale armed struggle achieve our goal? Not with their present aims and set-up.

Both these movements are exclusive in character, led by the local Bourgeoisie in the first instance and the local feudal lords in the second. They do not have international outlook, which is essential for our goal. They are perfectly right in declaring that there is national oppression. We do not quarrel with them on this score. But their intention is to stop there. They do not try to expand their struggles to the other nationalities. They do not attempt to make a broad-based assault on the foundations of the existing regime. They deliberately try to forget the connection of their local ruling classes with the national oppression. In short these movements are not led by peasants and workers. Therefore, they are not Socialists, it would only be a change of masters for the masses. But for the Socialists the welfare of the masses comes first.

The same can be said for the Gojjam uprising. But I would like to take this opportunity once again to show how much Amhara supremacism [supremacism] is taken for granted in this Campus.

To applaud the ELF is a sin. If anything favourable is written out, it is automatically refuted by both USUAA and NUEUS. But the Gojjam affair was different. Support for it was practically a show of identity to the so-called revolutionaries.

Mind you, I am just saying that these movements are not lasting solutions for our goal-the set-up of a genuine Nationalist Socialist State. I am all for them, the ELF, the Bale movements, the Gojjam uprising, to the extent that they have challenged and weakened the existing regime, and have created areas of discontent to be harnessed later on by a genuine Socialist revolution.

One thing again is certain. I do not oppose these movements just because they are secessionists. There is nothing wrong with secessionism as such. For that matter secession is much better than nationally oppressive government. I quote Lenin, “… People resort to secession only when national oppression and national antagonisms make joint life absolutely intolerable and hinder any and all economic intercourse. In that case the interests of the freedom of the class struggle will be best served by Secession. I would also like to quote the resolution on the question of nationalities from the London International Socialist Congress of 1896 attended, supported and adopted by the Bolsheviks who brought about the October revolution, This Congress declares that it stands for the full right of all nations to self-determination and expresses its sympathy for the workers and peasants of every country now suffering under the yoke of military, national or other absolutism.

As long as secession is led by the peasants and workers and believes in its internationalist obligation, it is not only to be supported but also militarily assisted. It is pure backwardness and selfishness to ask a people to be partners in being exploited till you can catch up. We should never dwell on the subject of secession, but whether it is progressive or reactionary. A Socialist Eritrea and Bale would give a great impetus to the revolution in the country and could form an egalitarian and democratic basis for re-unification.

To come back to our central question: How can we form a genuine egalitarian national-state? It is clear that we can achieve this goal only through violence, through revolutionary armed struggle. But we must always guard ourselves against the pseudo-nationalist propaganda of the regime. The revolution can start anywhere. It can even be secessionist to begin with, as long as led by the progressive forces-the peasants and the workers, and has the final aim the liberation of the Ethiopian Mass with due consideration to the economic and cultural independence of all the nationalities. It is the duty of every revolutionary to question whether a movement is Socialist or reactionary not whether a movement is secessionist or not. In the long run Socialism is internationalism and a Socialist movement will never remain secessionist for good.

To quote Lenin again, From their daily experience the masses know perfectly well the value of geographical and economic ties and the advantages of a big market and a big state. From this point of view of the struggle as well, a regime like ours harassed from corners is bound to collapse in a relatively short period of time. But when the degree of consciousness of the various nationalities is at different levels, it is not only the right but the duty of the most conscious nationality to first liberate itself and then assist others in the struggle for total liberation. Is that not true of Korea? We do support this movement, dont we? Then, what is this talk of tribalism, secessionism, etc..?


ቀውሱ ወዳጄ .....የታላቁ ዋለልኝ መኮንን ፅሁፍ መልእክቱ ምንአልባት ይዘልቅህ ከሆነ ደጋግመህ አንብብና ሞክረው

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ቆቁ

ዋና አለቃ


Joined: 21 Sep 2003
Posts: 4564
Location: united states

PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2012 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:


1. ባላባትና ጭሰኛ እንዴት ብሎ ነው ተሳስቦ ; ተቻችሎ ይኖር ነበር የምትለው Question አይ ቀውሱ ወዳጄ Laughing Laughing


ማነው ይህንን ያለው
የዋለልኝ ጥያቄ ይህ ነበር ?
ዋለልኝ እንደዚህ ያለ አስተሳሰብ ነበረው ?

Quote:
2. የብሔር ብሔረሰቦች እኩልነት እና ሶሻሊዝም እንዲሁም የዋለልኝ መኮንን ሀሳብ በኢትዮጵያ

1. የጋራ መግባቢያ


የጋራ መግባቢያ Exclamation Exclamation Exclamation
የቱጋ ነው በጋራ የተግባቡት የዛን ጊዜ ተማሪዎች ?


Quote:
2. ሶሻሊዝምና የብሔር ብሔረሰቦች እኩልነት በሶቭየት ህብረት

በፅንሰ -ሀሳብ ደረጃ ያለው የብሔር ብሔረሰቦች እኩልነት ለምን በሶቭየት ህብረት ውስጥ ሊተገበር አልቻለም


እኛ ምን አገባን ስለ ሶሻሊዝም ?
በራሺያ ችንቅላት ነው እንዴ የምንኖረው ?

Quote:
. ፈላስፋው ቆቁ አሁንም ያልተረዳኸው ነገር ቢኖር የብሔር ብሔረሰቦች እኩልነት የሚረጋገጠው በሶሻሊስታዊም ሆነ ካፒታሊስታዊ 'big government' እንደእርጥባን ከላይ ወደታች በሚደረግ ቸርነት አይደለም (የታላቁ ዋለልኝን መፍትሔ ወደታች እመለስበታለሁኝ )


እስቲ አንድ ምሳሌ ስጠኝ ፈዳላው
ይህ አባባል እልቂትና ጦርነት አይደለም ?


Quote:
. በፔትሮግራድ የከተሙት ቦልሼቪክሶች አነሳሳቸው በሰራተኛው መደብ ቢሆንም በዃላ ላይ የገነነው ወታደራዊ ክንፋቸው ምን ያህል ለመሰረታዊ ጥያቄዎች ምላሽ ይሰጣል ይህንንም ዋለልኝ ዳስሶታል


ምን አገባን ስለ ራሺያ እኮ ነው የምልህ


Quote:
. ችግሩን የኢኮኖሚ የመደብ ትግል ብቻ አርገው በመውሰዳቸው

እኛ የኢኮኖሞ እና የመደብ ትግል አልነበረንም ?

Quote:
3. ዋለልኝና ሶሻሊዝም

ባለፈው እንዳልኩት የሶሻሊዝም ፅንሰ -ሀሳቦች ምንም አያከራክሩም ....'Egalitarianism' እና 'Moralism"

ግን እንዚህን ሀሳቦች ከኢትዮጵያ ብሔር ብሔረሰቦች ማህበራዊ እኩልነት ኢኮኖሚያዊ ተጠቃሚነት ጋር እንዴት ማዛመድ ይቻላል ከሶቭየት ህብረቱ ጋርስ እንዴት ይለያል

አርቆ አስተዋዩ ዋለልኝ እንዲህ አስቀምጦታል


ዝምድናም ሆነ ጠላትነት የለንም
ስለ ራሺያ የአይዲኦሎጂ መመሪያ አያገባንም አራት ነጥብ ::


Quote:
1. የብሔሮች እኩልነት በራሳቸው ትግል እንጂ ከላይ ወደታች በሚመጣ ለውጥ ሊሳካ አይችልም


አንድ ወይም ሁለት ምሳሌ እባክህ በዓለማችን የተደረጉ የብሄሮች እኩልነቶች ? ታዲያ ያለምንም ደም መፋሰስ ?

Quote:
. በወታደራዊ መፈንቅለ -መንግስት የሚመጣ ለውጥ ምናልባት ትንሽ የሚሻል ይሆን እንደሆነ እንጂ የግለሰቦች መለዋወጥ ከመሆን ባለፈ የብሔሮችን ጥያቄ አይፈታም

ወታደራዊ መፈንቅለ መንግስት በኢትዮጵያ ተደርጎ ነበር ምን የተሻለ ነገር አመጣ ? እንዴትስ አድርጎ ነው የብሄሮችን ጥያቄ የሚፈታው ?

አሁንስ ያለው መንግስት እንዴት አድርጎ ነው የብሄሮችን ጥያቄ የሚፈታው ?

Quote:
. በተወሰኑ ልሂቃን የሚመራ ትግልም ቢሆን ብሔራዊ ጭቆናን መቃወማቸው ጥሩ ቢሆንም ከራሳቸው ሳጥን ውጪ ስላለው የጋራ ብሔራዊ ጭቆና ማየት ይሳናቸዋል


የአሁኑን የኢትዮጵያ መንግስት ማለትህ ነው ?

Quote:
ስለዚህ ትክክለኛው የብሔር ብሔረሰቦች እኩልነት እንዴት ይመጣል

1. ሁሉም የኢትዮጵያ ብሔር ብሔረሰቦች በራሳቸው በሰፊው ጭቁን ገበሬና ሰራተኛ የተመራ ትግል ማካሄድ አለባቸው


እንደዛ ዓይነት ትልግ የተካሄደበት የአለማችን ክፍል ብትጠቅስልኝ

የኢትዮጵያ ሁኔታ እንደዛ ነው ማለትህ ነው ?
እስቲ አስረዳኝ


Quote:

2. ራሳቸውን ነፃ ካወጡ በዃላ እጅን አጣጥፎ መቀመጥ ሳይሆን ሌሎችንም ራሳቸውን ነፃ እንዲያወጡ መርዳት ማገዝ ይጠበቅባቸዋል ...ልብ በል ፈላስፋው ቆቁ ነፃ አውጧቸው አይደለም


ይህ አባባል ኢሐዲግ የኤርትራ ሕዝብ ነጻ እንዳወጣ ማለት ይሆን ?

በነገራችን የኤርትራ ሕዝብ የብሄረ ሰቦች ጥርቅም አይደለም እንዴ ?


Quote:

3. ከዚህ በዃላ ሁሉም ነፃ ሲሆን ግቡ በሶሻሊስታዊ መርህ መሰረት በመፈቃቀድ ላይ የተመሰረተ ታሪካዊ ኢኮኖሚያዊ ባህላዊ ማህበራዊና ሀይማኖታዊ እኩልነት የሰፈነባት ኢትዮጵያን መገንባት


ተምኔታዊ ሶሻሊዝም የሚባል ነገር መኖሩን ዋለልኝ መኮንን አልሸመደደም ነበር ?


Quote:
ውሱ ቆቁ ...ዋለልኝ ተሳስቷል ...በሰላማዊ መንገድ ቀላል ነበር እያልክ ከምትለፋ ይህን 1955 የወጣውን የኢትዮጵያ ዘውዳዊ ህገመንግስት ተመልከተው ...አንቀፅ 4 እንዲህ ይላል


By virtue of His Imperial Blood, as well as by the anointing which He has received, the person of the Emperor is sacred, His dignity is inviolable and His Powers indisputable. He is consequently entitled to all the honors due to Him in accordance with tradition and the present Constitution. Any one so bold as to seek to injure the Emperor will be punished.



በትክክል ከአሌክሳንደር ዘግሬት ጀምሮ እስከ ጁሊየስ ሴዛር ከዛም እስከ ማን ልበልህ ንጉስ አይከሰስ ሰማይ አይታረስ ነበር የሚባለው
ንጉሱን ለመገልበጥ እና አዲስ ስርዓት ለማምጣት የግድ የቦልሼቪክ አይዲኦሎጂ ኢትዮጵያ ውስት መግባት አልነበረበትም ነው የምልህ

መንግስቱ ንዋይ ሞክሮ ነበር
መንግስቱ ሓይለማርያምም አንዋር ሳዳትን በመመልከት ነበር ደርግን የመሰረተው

Quote:

ስለሶሻሊዝም ደግሞ በጊዜው ከነበረው በአፍሪካም ሆነ በመላው አለም የነፃነት ትግሎች ጎን ይቆም የነበረው የሶሻሊዝም መርህ ስለነበር ታላቁ ዋለልኝ የሶሻሊዝምን ሀሳብ እንደማራጭ ቢይዘው የሚገርም አልነበረም ...በዛን ጊዜ የነበሩ የነፃነት ታጋዮች በሙሉ የሶሻሊዝም መርሆዎችን ያቀነቅኑ ነበር ...ለምሳሌ ማሀታማ ጋንዲ እንዲህ ብለዋል


[size=30]ጅላ ጅል Exclamation Exclamation ቴዎድሮስ ዮሐንስ ምኒሊክ በጊዜው በነበረው ሲስተም ኢትዮጵያን አንድ ለማድረግ በቅተዋል : ስማ ደብል ስታንዳርድ ማለት ሌላው የኑሮሎጂካል ዲሶርደር ስይምፕተም ነው ለዋለልኝ መኮንን ሲሆን ይፈቀድለታል ለምኒሊክ : ለዮሐንስ እና ለቴዎድሮስ ግን ልቃቂት አፍህን ትከፍታለህ Exclamation Exclamation [/size]

"
Quote:
Socialism is a beautiful word and, so far as I am aware, in socialism all the members of society are equal none low, none high. In the individual body, the head is not high because it is the top of the body, nor are the soles of the feet low because they touch the earth. Even as members of the individual body are equal, so are the members of society. This is socialism.

In it the prince and the peasant, the wealthy and the poor, the employer and employee are all on the same level. In terms of religion there is no duality in socialism. It is all unity.
Looking at society all the world over, there is nothing but duality or plurality. Unity is conspicuous by its absence. This man is high, that one is low, that is a Hindu, that a Muslim, third a Christian, fourth a Parsi, fifth a Sikh, sixth a Jew. Even among these there are sub-divisions. In the unity of my conception there is perfect unity in the plurality of designs.


ነበር የሞተ ወንድም ነው አሉ ይባላል
ድሀ በህልሞ ቅቤ ያኝካል አሉ ይባላል
ስማ ኮሙኒስም ኪስህ ኬሴ ነው የሚባልበት ዘመን ነው ይባል ነበር አሉ አሉ

Quote:


ዋናው ቁምነገር ዋለልኝ ሀሳቡ 'ጥይት መማዘዝና መተራረድ ' ቢሆን ኖሮ በቀላሉ የወታደሩን እንቅስቃሴ ይደግፍ ነበር ....እሱ ግን አላደረገውም

የትኛውን ወታደራዊ እንቅስቃሴ ?
እንዴት ነው ነገሩ
ራሱ ዋለልኝ ጥይት ( ኮልት ) ጨብጦ ነበር እኮ ምነው ፈዳላው ምን ነካህ Exclamation Exclamation

Quote:


የዋለልኝ ፍላጎት የግለሰቦች ወይም የፓርቲዎች ወይንም የመንግስታት መቀያየርም አይደለም ....የብሔሮችና የሀይማኖቶች እኩልነት ጥያቄ መመለሱ ላይ ነው

እንዴት ?
ይህንን ጥያቄ ሳያጤን እኮ ነው የዘባረቀው ነው የምልህ


ታላቁ : የመጀመሪያው እና የመጨረሻው ፈላስፋው ቆቁ
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ቆቁ

ዋና አለቃ


Joined: 21 Sep 2003
Posts: 4564
Location: united states

PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ፈዳላው ዳግማዊ ወደ ብሄረ ሰቦች ጥያቄ ካዘነበልክ


1. የዋለልኝ መኮንን ጽሁፍ የብሄረ ሰቦችን ጥያቄ እንዴት አድርጎ ነው ሊፈታ ይችል የነበረው ?
ማርክሲዝም የብሄሮችን ጥያቄ የፈታበት ቦታና ጊዜ ጨምረህ ::

2. የዋለልኝ መኮንን ጽሁፍ እንዴት አድርጎ ነበር የሴቶችን ጥያቄ ሊፈታ ይችል የነበረው ?
ማርክሲዝም እና ሌኒኒዝም የሴቶችን ጥያቄ የፈታበትን ጊዜና ቦታ ጨምረህ

3. በዋለልኝ ዘመን በኢትዮጵያ ዋነኛው ችግር ምን ነበር ይህ ችግር ከራሺያ ችግር ጋር በምን ይለያያል ?
የጭሰኛ እና የጉልተኛ ስርዓት ከሆነ የኢትዮጵያ ሕዝብ የዛን ጊዜ ችግር ለምን የብሄረ ሰቦች ጥያቄ እንደ መጀመሪያ ጭግር በዋለልኝ መኮንን ተጠነሰሰ ?


በነዚህ ነጥቦች ላይ ይሆናል ውይይታችን ይህንን ካጣጣምን በሁዋላ ስለ ኒውሮሎጂካል ዲሶርደር እናወራለን ይህንንም ራሱን "ባልሳቪክ " = ቦልሼቪክ የሚባለውን የአዲስ አበባ ዩኒቨርሲቲ ጋዜጣ እና የታገልን ጽሁፎች አብጠርጥረን የኑሮሎጂካል ዲሶርደር በጊዜው እንዴት እንደነበረ እንፈላሰፍበታለን

ለማስታወሻ ከዋለልኝ ጽሁፍ በአማርኛ
[size=30] የመገንጠል እንቅስቃሴ በገበሬዎችና ሰራተኞች እስከተመራና አለም አቀፋዊ ወዛደራዊነትን እስካመነ ድረስ በሐሳብ መደገፍ ሳይሆን ወታደራዊ እርዳታ ሊደረግለት ይገባል [/size]
ምን ማለት ነው ይህ አባባል ?

ለመሆኑ ገበሬዎች እና ሰራተኞች የመሩት አለምአቀፋዊ ወዛደርነት መቸና የት እንደነበረ እንደምታስረዳኝ ተስፋ አደርጋለሁ


የኢትዮጵያን ሁኔታ አስመልከተን ከላይ ዋለልኝ ስለ ጻፈው ጽሁፍ ስንፈላሰፍ

አቶ ኢሳያያስ አፈወርቅ እና የሚመሩት ቡድን የገበሬ እና የሰራተኛ ቡድን ነው ?

ጠቅላይ ምኒስቴር መለሰ ዜናዊ እና እሳቸው የሚመሩት ካቢኔ የወዛደርና የገበሬ ቡድን ነው ?

እንዴት አድርጎ ነው የገበሬ እና የሰራተኛ ቡድን አለማቀፋዊነት እና ወዛደራዊነት ሊመሰርት የሚችለው
ቦታ እና ጊዜ ጠቅሰህ እንደምታስረዳኝ ተስፋ አደርጋለሁ ::

ሌኒን ገበሬ ወይ ወዛደር ?
ማርክስ ገበሬ ወይስ ወዛደር ?
ኤንግልስ ገበሬ ወይስ ወዛደር ?
ቼጉቬራ ገበሬ ወይ ወዝአደር ?


ፈላስፋው እና ሳይካትሪስቱ ቆቁ
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ዳግማዊ ዋለልኝ

ዋና አለቃ


Joined: 20 Oct 2010
Posts: 2961

PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

1. ዋለልኝ ይህን ፅሁፍ እንዲፅፍ ያስገደደው በጊዜው ጥቂት የዩኒቨርስቲ ተማሪዎች በድብቅ እነዚህን ሀሳቦች ማንሳት እና መወያየት ጀምረው ነበር ....የእነዚህ ውይይቶች መጀመር ጭምጭምታ በመሰማቱም የተለያዩ አለመግባባቶችና የተጋነኑ አሉባልታዎች እንዲሁም የተሳሳቱ በራሪ ወረቀቶች መበተን ጀምረው ነበር

ስለዚህ ዋለልኝ ያለው ለዚህ 'አይነኬ ' ስለሆነው የብሄሮች ጥያቄ መፍትሄው ግልፅ ውይይት ስለሆነ ያለኝን ሀሳብ እነሆ ....ምንም እንኳን በቂ ያልሆኑ ትንተናዎችና ድማዳሜዎች ቢኖሩትም ለመነሻ ያህል ከበቂ በላይ ነው ....ሐረጎችን ከአውዳዊ ትርጉማቸው ውጪ ከመምዘዝ ባለፈ የተነሱትን ሁሉንም ነጥብ በአጠቃላይ ፅሁፉ ሀሳብ መንፈስ እንወያይበት ነው ......እርግጥ ሀሳቡ በጣም 'ሴንስቲቭ ' ቢሆንም ለመወያየት የሚሆን ብስለት ተማሪው እንደሚኖረው አስባለሁ ነው ታላቁ ዋለልኝ ያለው

2. የዋለልኝ ራዕይ

ዲሞክራሲያዊና እኩልነት የሰፈነባት ኢትዮጵያ

ሁሉም የኢትዮጵያ ብሄሮች ታሪካቸውን ባሕላቸውን ቋንቋቸውን የሚጠብቁበትና የሚያሳድጉበት እኩል እድል የሚያገኙበት ....በሀገራቸው ጉዳይ እኩል የሚሳተፉበት ....እንዲሁም ማንም ብሄር በሌላው ላይ ባሕሉን የማይጭንበት ሀገር መመስረት

3. የዋለልኝ መፍትሄ

በብዙሀኑ ማለትም በተራማጁ ገበሬውና ሰራተኛው የሚመራ ትግል ሶሻሊስታዊ አላማ እስካነገበ ድረስ ከብሄራዊ ጭቆና ለመገላገል ማንኛውም አማራጭ መገንጠልንም ጨምሮ ትክክል ነው

ምክንያቱም እነዚህ የፀረ -ብሄራዊ ጭቆና ትግሎች (መገንጠልንም ያካትታል ) በኢትዮጵያ ውስጥ ለሚኖረው አብዮት ጉልበት ከመሆንም አልፈው እኩልንነትንና ዲሞክራሲን መሰረት ላደረገ መልሶ ውህደት ጉልህ ሚና ይጫወታሉ .....ሶሻሊስታዊ እንቅስቃሴ አለማቀፍ እንደመሆኑ በረጅም ሂደት በምንም መልኩ መገንጠልን አያራምድም

ቀውሱ ቆቁ ....ዋለልኝ የኔ ሀሳብ ይኸውና እንወያይበት ብሎ አቅርቧል ....የኔ ሀሳብ ብቸኛው አማራጭና ለችግራችንም 'silver bullet' ነው አላለም

ቀውሱ ቆቁ ከምን ተነስተው ዋለልኝ 'እንዴት ኢትዮጵያ እነዚህን ብሄረ ሰቦች ይዛ በዲሞክራሲ እና በነጻነት : በእኩልነት ትራመዳለች የሚለውን ጥያቀ አለማሰቡና ለዚህ መፍትሄ መፈለግ አለመቻሉ ነው ' እንዳሉ ግራ ያጋባል

የቀውሱ ቆቁ መፍትሄ ደግሞ ምን ይሆን Question

ዳግማዊ ዋለልኝ ነኝ
የታላቁ ዋለልኝ መኮንን ደቀ -መዝሙር
_________________
“Meles Zenawi's passion was in abolishing poverty" Former Prime Minister of United Kingdom Gordon Brown
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ቆቁ

ዋና አለቃ


Joined: 21 Sep 2003
Posts: 4564
Location: united states

PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 8:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:


ቀውሱ ቆቁ ከምን ተነስተው ዋለልኝ 'እንዴት ኢትዮጵያ እነዚህን ብሄረ ሰቦች ይዛ በዲሞክራሲ እና በነጻነት : በእኩልነት ትራመዳለች የሚለውን ጥያቀ አለማሰቡና ለዚህ መፍትሄ መፈለግ አለመቻሉ ነው ' እንዳሉ ግራ ያጋባል


ዳግማዊ ፈዳላው
ዋለልኝ ይህንን ሐሳብ ከየት አመጣው የሚለው ጥያቄ ነው አጠራጣሪ የሆነው

1. ይህ የማርክሲዝም ቲዎሪ በአዲስ አበባ ዩኒቨርሲቲ በዋለልኝ ዘመን ይሰጥ ነበር ?

2. ዋለልኝ የራሱን ሐሳብ ሳይሆን የሰጠው 1986 በለንደን በተደረገው የሶሻሊስት ኮንግረስ የተለላለፈን ዲክሌሬሽን ነው :: ይህ ዲክሌሬችን የጥቅምቱን የራሺያ አብዮት እንዳስከተለ ራሱ ገልጾታል

ስማ ፈዳላው ቅል ራስህ ነህ ልበል ?
በኢትዮጵያ የንጉሱ ጨቁዋኝነት እና የጉልተኛ እና የገባር ኑሮ የኢትዮጵያን ሕዝብ ቢያንገሸግሸውም እነ ዋለልኝ መፍትሄ ሳይሆን ኩረጃ ነው ያመጡለት ::


ለማስታወስ ያህል

አወጣሽ ስዩም በዋለልኝ ዘመን የአንደኛ አመት ዩኒቨርሲቲ ተማሪ የነበረች በታገል ጋዜጣ ላይ

"" የአቶ ዋለልኝ የውይት ነጥቦች ከሞላ ጎደል ከእውነት ያልራቁ ቢሆኑም አብዛኛዎቹ ግን ከመዘበራረቃቸው የተነሳ
ሊታመኑ የማይችሉና አጠራጣሪዎች ናቸው "" በማለት ዘግባለች
ይህንንስ እንዴት ታየዋለህ ፈዳላው

ፈላስፋው ቆቁ እና ሳይካትሪስቱ
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ዳግማዊ ዋለልኝ

ዋና አለቃ


Joined: 20 Oct 2010
Posts: 2961

PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 7:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ሠላም ቀውሱ ወዳጄ

መቀባጠርህን ትተህ ጥያቄ ስትጠይቅማ ደስታውን አልችለውም Wink

Quote:
ዋለልኝ ይህንን ሐሳብ ከየት አመጣው የሚለው ጥያቄ ነው አጠራጣሪ የሆነው

1. ይህ የማርክሲዝም ቲዎሪ በአዲስ አበባ ዩኒቨርሲቲ በዋለልኝ ዘመን ይሰጥ ነበር ?


1. ታላቁ ዋለልኝ መኮንን የፖሊቲካል ሳይንስ ተማሪ ነበር .....ስለዚህ ስለማርክሲዝም /ሶሻሊዝም ሀሳቦች ለመማር እድሉ ነበረው ......በጊዜው በአዲስ አበባ ዩኒቨርሲቲ ባይሰጥ እንኳን እንደፖሊቲካል ሳይንስ ተማሪነቱና ጉብዝናው መጠን በግሉ እንደሚያነብ እርግጠኛ ነኝ

2. ታላቁ ዋለልኝ የፖሊቲካል ሳይንስ ተማሪ ብሎም የአዲስ አበባ ዩኒቨርሲቲ ተማሪ እንኳን ባይሆን ኖሮ እንኳን እንደአንተ ቀውስ የሆነ ሰው ካልሆነ በስተቀር እከሌ ይህንን ቲዎሪ /ሀሳብ ማወቁ አጠራጣሪ ያደርገዋል የሚል ሰው የለም Laughing Laughing Laughing ምን የሚሉት መከራከሪያና ጥርጣሬ ነው Question ......ቀውሱ ወዳጄ በጣም ታስቃለህ Laughing Laughing መመዘን ያለበት ሀሳቡ እንጂ ይሄን ቲዎሪ እንዴት አወቀ ; ለምን አወቀ ; እንዴት እንዳወቀ ያጠራጥራል የሚል የመሀይም ሀሳብ ከአንተ ሰማሁ Wink

Quote:
2. ዋለልኝ የራሱን ሐሳብ ሳይሆን የሰጠው 1986 በለንደን በተደረገው የሶሻሊስት ኮንግረስ የተለላለፈን ዲክሌሬሽን ነው :: ይህ ዲክሌሬችን የጥቅምቱን የራሺያ አብዮት እንዳስከተለ ራሱ ገልጾታል


ቀውስም ደደብም ነህ .....ይቅርታ ወዳጄ ...ስድብ ሳይሆን እውነታ ነው .....አንብብ ብዬ ያመጣሁልህን ፅሁፍ እንኳን መረዳት አልቻልክም ......ታላቁ ዋለልኝ ስለኢትዮጵያ ህዝቦች ; ባህል ; ቋንቋ ስብጥር እንዲሁም የእኩልነት ጥያቄ የፃፈው 1986 ከተደረገው የሶሽሻሊስት ኮንግረስ ዲክሌሬሽን ወስዶ ነውን Question Laughing ስለታደሰ ብሩ እና የገርማሜ እና መንግስቱ ንዋይ መፈነቅለ -መንግስት ያወራው ከሶሻሊስት ኮንግረስ ቀድቶ ነውን Question Wink አይ ደደቡ ወዳጄ

ስለኤርትራ ; ባሌ እና ጎጃም የነፃነት እና ትጥቅ ትግል ንቅናቄዎች የጠቀሰውስ አሁንም 1986 ዲክሌሬሽን ይሆን Question Surprised

በአንተ በደደቡ ቤት የሌኒንን ፅሁፍ ስለጠቀሰ ወይንም 1986ቱን የሶሻሊስት ኮንግረስ ሪዞሊዩሽን ስለጠቀሰ ; ዋለልኝ ሀሳቡን ያመጣው ከኮንገረሱ ነው Question Laughing Laughing Laughing አንብቦ የመረዳት አቅም ስለሌለህ እንጂ ሌኒንንም ሆነ ሪዞሊዩሽኑን ለምን እንደጠቀሰ የዋለልኝን ፅሁፍ ያነበበ ሰው በቀላሉ ይገባዋል

Quote:
ለማስታወስ ያህል

አወጣሽ ስዩም በዋለልኝ ዘመን የአንደኛ አመት ዩኒቨርሲቲ ተማሪ የነበረች በታገል ጋዜጣ ላይ

"" የአቶ ዋለልኝ የውይት ነጥቦች ከሞላ ጎደል ከእውነት ያልራቁ ቢሆኑም አብዛኛዎቹ ግን ከመዘበራረቃቸው የተነሳ
ሊታመኑ የማይችሉና አጠራጣሪዎች ናቸው "" በማለት ዘግባለች
ይህንንስ እንዴት ታየዋለህ ፈዳላው


Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

1. አወጣሽም ትሁን አገባሽ ማንም ይለፍልፍ ዋናው የረሳኸው ነጥብ እኮ ለምን "ከመዘበራረቃቸው የተነሳ ሊታመኑ የማይችሉና አጠራጣሪዎች " እንዳለች አልገለፅክም .....ምኑ ነው የተዘበራረቀው Question Wink

2. "የአቶ ዋለልኝ የውይይት ነጥቦች ከሞላ ጎደል ከእውነት ያልራቁ ናቸው " ብላ ከመሰከረች በኻላ "ስለተዘበራረቁ ግን ሊታመኑ የማይችሉ አጠራጣሪ ናቸው " ምን ማለት ነው Question Laughing Laughing Laughing

"እውነት ነው ግን ስለተዘበራረቀ ሊታመን አይችልም " የሚል አገላለፅ ራሱ በጣም የተዘበራረቀ ነው Laughing እውነት ምንጊዜም እውነት ነው .....ተዘበራረቀ ; ቀጠነ ; አነሰ ብሎ የለም ......ጭራሽ እውነት ነው እያለች መልሳ ሊታመን አይችልም ብሎ መቀባጠር ምናልባት የቀውሶች መግባቢያ ይሆናል Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

ሠላም
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“Meles Zenawi's passion was in abolishing poverty" Former Prime Minister of United Kingdom Gordon Brown
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ደቦል

አዲስ


Joined: 18 Jun 2012
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ከየትኛው አናሳ ወገን ነህ አንተ ደሞ እጢ ምናምን የምትል Laughing

አቤት ኢንፌሪየሪቲ ኮምፕሌክስ Laughing


እናስ በቋንቋህ ጻፍ እንጅ በገዥዎችህ ቋንቋ ለምን Laughing Laughing


ነጻ ወጠናል ትላላቹ ግን ገና ነጻ አልወጣችሁም Laughing
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ደቦል

አዲስ


Joined: 18 Jun 2012
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

የሞትን , እኛ ያለንም እኛ ባለህበት ርጋ አለ ልጅ እያሱ Laughing




ሳንገዛም እየገዛንህ ነው Laughing Laughing


.
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ዳግማዊ ዋለልኝ

ዋና አለቃ


Joined: 20 Oct 2010
Posts: 2961

PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ደቦል እንደጻፈ(ች)ው:
የሞትን , እኛ ያለንም እኛ ባለህበት ርጋ አለ ልጅ እያሱ .


በእጢዎች የእርስ በእርስ መጠፋፋት ለራሱ መሆን አቅቶት በአፋር ; በትግራይ እና በወሎ እንደአይጥ እየተሽሎከለከ የት እንደሞተ የማይታወቀውን ኢያሱን ስትጠራ አታፍርም እንዴ Question Laughing Laughing እንኳን የተናገረው ይቅርና በምን እንደሞተና የት እንደተቀበረም በውል አያታወቅም .......ፅድቁ ቀርቶ በቅጡ በኮነነው Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
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“Meles Zenawi's passion was in abolishing poverty" Former Prime Minister of United Kingdom Gordon Brown
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ደቦል

አዲስ


Joined: 18 Jun 2012
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

አንበሳ ከአንበሳ ጋር አንዳንዴ ይጣላል Rolling Eyes


አንተ አናሳው ቀበሮ ባንበሳዎች ጠብ ምናገባህ Shocked



ዳግማዊ ዋለልኝ እንደጻፈ(ች)ው:
ደቦል እንደጻፈ(ች)ው:
የሞትን , እኛ ያለንም እኛ ባለህበት ርጋ አለ ልጅ እያሱ .


በእጢዎች የእርስ በእርስ መጠፋፋት ለራሱ መሆን አቅቶት በአፋር ; በትግራይ እና በወሎ እንደአይጥ እየተሽሎከለከ የት እንደሞተ የማይታወቀውን ኢያሱን ስትጠራ አታፍርም እንዴ Question Laughing Laughing እንኳን የተናገረው ይቅርና በምን እንደሞተና የት እንደተቀበረም በውል አያታወቅም .......ፅድቁ ቀርቶ በቅጡ በኮነነው Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
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ዳግማዊ ዋለልኝ

ዋና አለቃ


Joined: 20 Oct 2010
Posts: 2961

PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

የአንፌቃ ህግ ጠፍንጎህ ስምህን ቀይረህ የመጣኸው ደደብ

1. በምን እንደሞተ እና የት እንደተቀበረ ስላልታወቀው ኢያሱ ምንም ማለት ስላልቻልክ ተፈናጥረህ ተረት ውስጥ ገባህ ...ዲየዲየብ Laughing Laughing

2. አይጥ መቼ ነው አንበሳ የሆነው Question Laughing Laughing ኢያሱ እንደአይጥ ሲሽሎከለክ ኖሮ እንደአይጥ ባልታወቀ ስርቻ ውስጥ ሞተ .......እጢው ተፈሪንም ቢሆን መንግስቱ እንደአይጥ ገሎ እንደአይጥ ጉድጓድ ውስጥ ጣለው ......ነፍስ ይማር Rolling Eyes

አንበስነት ቀርቶባቸው ...በቅጡ በገደላቸው Laughing Laughing

ደቦል እንደጻፈ(ች)ው:
አንበሳ ከአንበሳ ጋር አንዳንዴ ይጣላል Rolling Eyes


አንተ አናሳው ቀበሮ ባንበሳዎች ጠብ ምናገባህ Shocked



ዳግማዊ ዋለልኝ እንደጻፈ(ች)ው:
ደቦል እንደጻፈ(ች)ው:
የሞትን , እኛ ያለንም እኛ ባለህበት ርጋ አለ ልጅ እያሱ .


በእጢዎች የእርስ በእርስ መጠፋፋት ለራሱ መሆን አቅቶት በአፋር ; በትግራይ እና በወሎ እንደአይጥ እየተሽሎከለከ የት እንደሞተ የማይታወቀውን ኢያሱን ስትጠራ አታፍርም እንዴ Question Laughing Laughing እንኳን የተናገረው ይቅርና በምን እንደሞተና የት እንደተቀበረም በውል አያታወቅም .......ፅድቁ ቀርቶ በቅጡ በኮነነው Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

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“Meles Zenawi's passion was in abolishing poverty" Former Prime Minister of United Kingdom Gordon Brown
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ዳግማዊ ዋለልኝ

ዋና አለቃ


Joined: 20 Oct 2010
Posts: 2961

PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ሠላም ቀውሱ ወዳጄ

መቀባጠርህን ትተህ ጥያቄ ስትጠይቅማ ደስታውን አልችለውም Wink

Quote:
ዋለልኝ ይህንን ሐሳብ ከየት አመጣው የሚለው ጥያቄ ነው አጠራጣሪ የሆነው

1. ይህ የማርክሲዝም ቲዎሪ በአዲስ አበባ ዩኒቨርሲቲ በዋለልኝ ዘመን ይሰጥ ነበር ?


1. ታላቁ ዋለልኝ መኮንን የፖሊቲካል ሳይንስ ተማሪ ነበር .....ስለዚህ ስለማርክሲዝም /ሶሻሊዝም ሀሳቦች ለመማር እድሉ ነበረው ......በጊዜው በአዲስ አበባ ዩኒቨርሲቲ ባይሰጥ እንኳን እንደፖሊቲካል ሳይንስ ተማሪነቱና ጉብዝናው መጠን በግሉ እንደሚያነብ እርግጠኛ ነኝ

2. ታላቁ ዋለልኝ የፖሊቲካል ሳይንስ ተማሪ ብሎም የአዲስ አበባ ዩኒቨርሲቲ ተማሪ እንኳን ባይሆን ኖሮ እንኳን እንደአንተ ቀውስ የሆነ ሰው ካልሆነ በስተቀር እከሌ ይህንን ቲዎሪ /ሀሳብ ማወቁ አጠራጣሪ ያደርገዋል የሚል ሰው የለም Laughing Laughing Laughing ምን የሚሉት መከራከሪያና ጥርጣሬ ነው Question ......ቀውሱ ወዳጄ በጣም ታስቃለህ Laughing Laughing መመዘን ያለበት ሀሳቡ እንጂ ይሄን ቲዎሪ እንዴት አወቀ ; ለምን አወቀ ; እንዴት እንዳወቀ ያጠራጥራል የሚል የመሀይም ሀሳብ ከአንተ ሰማሁ Wink

Quote:
2. ዋለልኝ የራሱን ሐሳብ ሳይሆን የሰጠው 1986 በለንደን በተደረገው የሶሻሊስት ኮንግረስ የተለላለፈን ዲክሌሬሽን ነው :: ይህ ዲክሌሬችን የጥቅምቱን የራሺያ አብዮት እንዳስከተለ ራሱ ገልጾታል


ቀውስም ደደብም ነህ .....ይቅርታ ወዳጄ ...ስድብ ሳይሆን እውነታ ነው .....አንብብ ብዬ ያመጣሁልህን ፅሁፍ እንኳን መረዳት አልቻልክም ......ታላቁ ዋለልኝ ስለኢትዮጵያ ህዝቦች ; ባህል ; ቋንቋ ስብጥር እንዲሁም የእኩልነት ጥያቄ የፃፈው 1986 ከተደረገው የሶሽሻሊስት ኮንግረስ ዲክሌሬሽን ወስዶ ነውን Question Laughing ስለታደሰ ብሩ እና የገርማሜ እና መንግስቱ ንዋይ መፈነቅለ -መንግስት ያወራው ከሶሻሊስት ኮንግረስ ቀድቶ ነውን Question Wink አይ ደደቡ ወዳጄ

ስለኤርትራ ; ባሌ እና ጎጃም የነፃነት እና ትጥቅ ትግል ንቅናቄዎች የጠቀሰውስ አሁንም 1986 ዲክሌሬሽን ይሆን Question Surprised

በአንተ በደደቡ ቤት የሌኒንን ፅሁፍ ስለጠቀሰ ወይንም 1986ቱን የሶሻሊስት ኮንግረስ ሪዞሊዩሽን ስለጠቀሰ ; ዋለልኝ ሀሳቡን ያመጣው ከኮንገረሱ ነው Question Laughing Laughing Laughing አንብቦ የመረዳት አቅም ስለሌለህ እንጂ ሌኒንንም ሆነ ሪዞሊዩሽኑን ለምን እንደጠቀሰ የዋለልኝን ፅሁፍ ያነበበ ሰው በቀላሉ ይገባዋል

Quote:
ለማስታወስ ያህል

አወጣሽ ስዩም በዋለልኝ ዘመን የአንደኛ አመት ዩኒቨርሲቲ ተማሪ የነበረች በታገል ጋዜጣ ላይ

"" የአቶ ዋለልኝ የውይት ነጥቦች ከሞላ ጎደል ከእውነት ያልራቁ ቢሆኑም አብዛኛዎቹ ግን ከመዘበራረቃቸው የተነሳ
ሊታመኑ የማይችሉና አጠራጣሪዎች ናቸው "" በማለት ዘግባለች
ይህንንስ እንዴት ታየዋለህ ፈዳላው


Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

1. አወጣሽም ትሁን አገባሽ ማንም ይለፍልፍ ዋናው የረሳኸው ነጥብ እኮ ለምን "ከመዘበራረቃቸው የተነሳ ሊታመኑ የማይችሉና አጠራጣሪዎች " እንዳለች አልገለፅክም .....ምኑ ነው የተዘበራረቀው Question Wink

2. "የአቶ ዋለልኝ የውይይት ነጥቦች ከሞላ ጎደል ከእውነት ያልራቁ ናቸው " ብላ ከመሰከረች በኻላ "ስለተዘበራረቁ ግን ሊታመኑ የማይችሉ አጠራጣሪ ናቸው " ምን ማለት ነው Question Laughing Laughing Laughing

"እውነት ነው ግን ስለተዘበራረቀ ሊታመን አይችልም " የሚል አገላለፅ ራሱ በጣም የተዘበራረቀ ነው Laughing እውነት ምንጊዜም እውነት ነው .....ተዘበራረቀ ; ቀጠነ ; አነሰ ብሎ የለም ......ጭራሽ እውነት ነው እያለች መልሳ ሊታመን አይችልም ብሎ መቀባጠር ምናልባት የቀውሶች መግባቢያ ይሆናል Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

ሠላም
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“Meles Zenawi's passion was in abolishing poverty" Former Prime Minister of United Kingdom Gordon Brown
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ደቦል

አዲስ


Joined: 18 Jun 2012
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

እኔ ካመታት በፊት ተሳታፊ ነበርኩ ፓስወርደ ረሳሁ ::


እንዳንት አናሳ ስላልሆንኩ ላገር እንጂ ለዋርካ ፓሶርድ አልጨነቅም አንተ ግን አዲስ አናሳ መሆን አለብህ አላውቅህም Rolling Eyes


አናሳው ሆይ ልጅ እያሱ ጠቡ ከራሱ ከአንበሶቹ ጋር ነበር አልኩህ :: በሌላ አንበሳ ተሸነፈ ሞተ :


ባንበሶች ጠብ አናሳ ቀበሮና ጅብ ምን ጥልቅ አረጋቸው Laughing


ጃንሆይን መንጌ ገደልኳቸው አላለም ;: ያንተ አይነት አናሳ የጻፈውን መረጃ አንብብ እንዳትለኝ Rolling Eyes





ዳግማዊ ዋለልኝ እንደጻፈ(ች)ው:
የአንፌቃ ህግ ጠፍንጎህ ስምህን ቀይረህ የመጣኸው ደደብ

1. በምን እንደሞተ እና የት እንደተቀበረ ስላልታወቀው ኢያሱ ምንም ማለት ስላልቻልክ ተፈናጥረህ ተረት ውስጥ ገባህ ...ዲየዲየብ Laughing Laughing

2. አይጥ መቼ ነው አንበሳ የሆነው Question Laughing Laughing ኢያሱ እንደአይጥ ሲሽሎከለክ ኖሮ እንደአይጥ ባልታወቀ ስርቻ ውስጥ ሞተ .......እጢው ተፈሪንም ቢሆን መንግስቱ እንደአይጥ ገሎ እንደአይጥ ጉድጓድ ውስጥ ጣለው ......ነፍስ ይማር Rolling Eyes

አንበስነት ቀርቶባቸው ...በቅጡ በገደላቸው Laughing Laughing

ደቦል እንደጻፈ(ች)ው:
አንበሳ ከአንበሳ ጋር አንዳንዴ ይጣላል Rolling Eyes


አንተ አናሳው ቀበሮ ባንበሳዎች ጠብ ምናገባህ Shocked



ዳግማዊ ዋለልኝ እንደጻፈ(ች)ው:
ደቦል እንደጻፈ(ች)ው:
የሞትን , እኛ ያለንም እኛ ባለህበት ርጋ አለ ልጅ እያሱ .


በእጢዎች የእርስ በእርስ መጠፋፋት ለራሱ መሆን አቅቶት በአፋር ; በትግራይ እና በወሎ እንደአይጥ እየተሽሎከለከ የት እንደሞተ የማይታወቀውን ኢያሱን ስትጠራ አታፍርም እንዴ Question Laughing Laughing እንኳን የተናገረው ይቅርና በምን እንደሞተና የት እንደተቀበረም በውል አያታወቅም .......ፅድቁ ቀርቶ በቅጡ በኮነነው Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
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